DEAD DROP: "The Ministry of Ungentlemanly Warfare"

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Keep calm and carry arms. We are the spy fi guys, and this is the ministry of ungentlemanly warfare. Hello and welcome back to the spy fi guys, where we cover spy facts, spy fiction and everything in between. I'm Zach. [00:00:19] Speaker B: And I'm Christian. [00:00:21] Speaker A: And we are back with a dead drop about the movie that came out just last week, the ministry of ungentlemanly Warfare. [00:00:27] Speaker B: So not only have we seen the movie, but we actually got to, as we talked about our last episode, we got to do a little intro for our local Alamo cinema drafthouse for the movie, as well as we got to do a live reaction like fresh out of the theater of what we thought of the movie. Spoiler free. Let's drop that in here. Now. Just fair warning, it is, you know, live. So our audio is not the best, but, you know, here's what our initial thoughts were. [00:00:53] Speaker C: That's right. [00:00:54] Speaker A: And go back a little. [00:00:56] Speaker B: Alrighty. [00:00:57] Speaker A: Alright. Hi, everyone. It's Zach and Christian here. [00:01:00] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:01:00] Speaker D: So this is our first sort of live, first on camera and first live reaction right after a movie. Zach, what do you think? [00:01:09] Speaker A: So we are here at the Alamo Drafthouse on Bryant street in Washington, DC. [00:01:13] Speaker D: Yeah, we're in the Highbinder bar, which is spy theme. We put up some photos up on our social media this. [00:01:20] Speaker A: Right. So we just got out of the ministry of Ungentlemanly Warfare, a special screening hosted by the Alamo drafthouse after Christian schmoozed with them at awesome. [00:01:28] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:01:29] Speaker A: And so yeah, we're here to do our initial reactions for the movie. So something that jumped out to me about the movie, it's based on the old school World War Two. [00:01:39] Speaker D: Like your, your dirty dozen, your Kelly's heroes, that kind of thing. Yeah, I definitely felt that. And I like that because we'll go back to our last episode of what was it? A bridge too far. That's what I wanted from that movie, which is not what that movie was. So because of that, obviously I like this a lot. I think because that's what I was looking for. Really. [00:01:59] Speaker A: Well, sure. I mean, a bridge too far is supposed to be real, true or as pleased as close to reality as they could get. [00:02:05] Speaker B: Right. [00:02:05] Speaker D: And this one, this is based on a true story. It's not gonna be. It's definitely not too well. But I will say I'm about to a third of way through the book that this is based on. And I mean, from what I could tell, like I was, I thought that they just threw any, I wasn't sure in for the movie. If they threw an Ian Fleming, just because everyone knows, you know, Ian Fleming was in World War Two in intelligence, but he's actually in there, so. [00:02:31] Speaker A: And for once, he's not the biggest. [00:02:32] Speaker C: Asshole in the room. [00:02:34] Speaker D: That's true. [00:02:35] Speaker A: Surprising. [00:02:36] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. [00:02:37] Speaker D: Actually, that was. [00:02:38] Speaker B: It was. [00:02:39] Speaker D: I would have enjoyed less. More Fleming, but because other than. All right, he says, you know, Fleming and Fleming, there's really nothing that marks him as distinctive as being Fleming. [00:02:50] Speaker A: That's right. [00:02:51] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:02:51] Speaker A: So he doesn't do anything to indicate that. And considering the movie, you know how I feel about the term based on a true story. [00:02:57] Speaker C: Right. [00:02:58] Speaker A: I usually think it's a lot of nonsense. [00:02:59] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:03:00] Speaker A: So if you're going to exaggerate for the movie, then why not exaggerate his role, too? [00:03:04] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, yeah. We'll see. [00:03:08] Speaker B: We'll see. [00:03:09] Speaker D: I'm still gonna finish this, the book, but I'm curious how much his role is actually in there. One of the things that I know I heard from pre production or just sort of like the usual press junket stuff they do for this is that initially. What's his name? The guy? Larson. Sweden. The swedish guy. [00:03:31] Speaker A: Oh, yes. [00:03:33] Speaker D: Alan Richardson's character was toned down, but Allen Richardson did his homework and made want to make him as brutal as the real character or person was. [00:03:43] Speaker A: I see. [00:03:45] Speaker D: So. But I thought the action was good. [00:03:49] Speaker B: I enjoyed Henry Cavill in it. [00:03:50] Speaker D: I wish there was a bit more Henry Golding, both of whom are two of my picks for the next James Bond. So it was fun to see them both in the same movie. Witty and fleming, you know, it's fun. We'll see. See if it leads anywhere. [00:04:03] Speaker C: Yeah. So. [00:04:04] Speaker A: And then another observation I had was that I appreciated that it took place in Africa. [00:04:08] Speaker D: You know, you always see that many world war two things in Africa, say, for, like, Casablanca. [00:04:13] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, the only ones they have already, North Africa. And this was. It wasn't even. [00:04:16] Speaker D: That's true. [00:04:17] Speaker C: That's true. [00:04:17] Speaker A: That was neat. Very international movie. Any other thoughts about the movie? [00:04:24] Speaker D: I say, indeed. I mean, I said the actor was good. Actual. I thought, you know, cinema thought cinematography was good. I saw Guy Ritchie's last movie, which also happened to have Carrie Elways, which was like Operation Fortune, Ruz de Gear or whatever, and that was terrible. I don't know. I'm glad he switched up his cinematography for this, at least, I think. I haven't actually done any research on that, but, yeah, I think. I think that's it for me. So, yeah, we'll go into a full spoiler filled episode. Once we record that, we'll also probably drop in the audio from this, but, yeah, sounds good. [00:05:01] Speaker A: Thanks to everyone who came to Alamo Drafthouse to celebrate with us. [00:05:04] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:05:05] Speaker D: Thanks all for joining us. I'm Christian. [00:05:07] Speaker A: And I'm Zach. [00:05:08] Speaker D: And we're the spy fi guys signing off. [00:05:10] Speaker A: Bye. And we're back. [00:05:15] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:05:15] Speaker B: So, with a little, I guess, distance from it, do you say your reaction, your thoughts sort of hold, stay the same? [00:05:25] Speaker A: Shall we wait maybe until the end of the episode to discuss that? [00:05:29] Speaker B: Okay, sure. [00:05:29] Speaker C: Sure. [00:05:30] Speaker B: I'm curious now. [00:05:31] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:05:32] Speaker A: So today is a dead drop episode, which means the rules are a little bit different. No poetry synopsis, no favorite quotes. And our recap of the movie will be a little bit less detailed because we weren't able to take notes in the theater. [00:05:46] Speaker B: Now, I'm trying to think if I'd had any favorite quotes to even to use. I'm sure I've got some, but I just. I'd have to watch it again for that. [00:05:54] Speaker C: Yes. [00:05:55] Speaker A: So for now, here's the IMDb plot summary. The british military recruits a small group of highly skilled soldiers to strike against german forces behind enemy lines during World War two. [00:06:05] Speaker C: Alrighty. [00:06:06] Speaker B: So we start with this. Actually, I'm trying to remember. How do we. We start with this movie on the boat, don't we? [00:06:13] Speaker A: Well, first we get that it's based on a true story. [00:06:15] Speaker B: Oh, that's right. Of course. Yes. [00:06:17] Speaker A: It's from the recently declassified files of Winston Churchill 2016. [00:06:22] Speaker B: Something like that. [00:06:23] Speaker A: Yeah. Which makes sense because it's 50 years after the events after the war ended. [00:06:29] Speaker B: So, yeah. So I believe we start on the boat with kind of like Henry Cavill and his ragtag group of mercenaries almost. [00:06:40] Speaker A: You might say, ne'er do wells. [00:06:42] Speaker B: Yeah, there we go. Or they're blowing up a british. Or not a british. It would be bad if it was british. A nazi boat. [00:06:50] Speaker A: Yeah, a nazi ship. And they do it with a Henry Golding, who can apparently swim what looks like half a mile without needing external oxygen and carrying bombs with him. [00:07:01] Speaker B: Quite the swimmer and also quite the explosives expert. So you have, should we round out our crew that we have here? So we have Henry Cavill as Gus march Phillips. We've got Allen Richardson as Anders Lawson, Henry Golding as Freddie Alvarez. Alex Pettifer as Jeffrey Appleyard. And hero finds Tiffin as Henry Hayes. [00:07:25] Speaker A: So what did you think at the beginning where they were pretending to be a gay couple out on, like, a pleasure cruise? I did kind of like that. [00:07:32] Speaker B: It was very camp, but I just enjoy. Like, you know, I liked when they just couldn't stop laughing. [00:07:39] Speaker C: Yep. [00:07:40] Speaker A: Do you think? And then of the swedish accents, which makes them sound like the swedish chef. [00:07:45] Speaker B: Right. I mean, and that was supposed to be Lawson's, like, actual accent. Of course. March Phillips was putting on an accent there because he's actually a Brit. [00:07:54] Speaker C: Mm hmm. Yeah. [00:07:55] Speaker B: So they blow up the boat, and then you get one of those flashbacks of what are we doing here? [00:07:59] Speaker C: That's right. [00:08:00] Speaker B: It's revealed that, you know, we meet brigadier Gubbins, otherwise known as M, who's played by Carrie Elwes. [00:08:07] Speaker A: Yeah, I didn't recognize Carrie Elwes. [00:08:10] Speaker B: I mean, he looks like Carrie Elwes, but older. [00:08:13] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:08:14] Speaker B: When was the last time you've seen Carrie Elwis in something? [00:08:16] Speaker A: I've seen him when he was older, but it's been a while. Yeah. [00:08:19] Speaker B: Okay. All right, all right. I'm just. Just wondering. Yeah, so he is basically putting together a crew for this highly specialized mission with, you know, straight orders, straight from Winston Churchill. Also, Ian Fleming is in on this meeting portrayed by Freddie Fox. Marge Phillips gets recruited into this even though he had just been in prison because he was not popular with the administration, shall we say. [00:08:46] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:08:46] Speaker A: Did you like the busting your main character out of prison, kind of like mission impossible, ghost protocol? [00:08:52] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:08:52] Speaker B: Well, it wasn't as much as that because you don't get to see him breaking out. You just see him getting released. [00:08:58] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:08:58] Speaker A: It's a little bit more realistic for once. [00:09:01] Speaker B: Yeah. And also helping himself to all of the brandy and cigars. Or is it whiskey? Might have been whiskey. [00:09:07] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:09:08] Speaker A: Like I said, ian Fleming is actually kind of toned down compared to everybody else in this movie. [00:09:14] Speaker B: So, yeah, their mission is to blow up this boat, which is supplying all of the Nazi U boats in the Atlantic on the spanish controlled island of Fernando Po. When I say boat, I mean ship. Like a large container ship. [00:09:29] Speaker C: That's right. [00:09:30] Speaker B: Yeah. So it's basically, the boat is called the Duchessa de Osta, and it's. [00:09:38] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:09:38] Speaker B: So their plan is to do that. So they. But first they have to go rescue their. The only person that Gus Marsh Phillips would do the mission with is Jeffrey Appleyard, who has been. [00:09:51] Speaker A: So this reminded me of actually a lot of stuff in the movie, reminded me of a video game, but this was. You got the main quest. Before you could do the main quest, you have to do the side quest because he's the only one that they can do it. [00:10:06] Speaker C: Right. [00:10:07] Speaker A: They can't do it without him. [00:10:08] Speaker B: But, yeah, we have two soe agents Mister Harren and Marjorie Stewart, played by Babs Olusan Mukun and Isaac Gonzalez, respectively. [00:10:23] Speaker A: And they're the spies. [00:10:24] Speaker B: And Babs, you might recognize from strange new worlds where he plays a doctor whose name I forget off the top of my head now. But anyway, so, yeah, so their mission is basically they have to keep all of the nazi forces on the island, you know, well, nazi and italian, basically the axis forces on the island occupied. So Marjorie is going to focus on the nazi leader because he never comes to any of the parties, whereas Mister Heron is going to occupy the rest of them by throwing a party for both the officers and the enlisted men separately. [00:10:59] Speaker A: Pretty good plan. [00:11:01] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:11:01] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:11:02] Speaker A: I feel like we've seen this somewhere before. Was it inglourious basterds where they have a party for the Nazis so they could kill him? [00:11:10] Speaker B: Yes, but it wasn't in. I mean, it wasn't planned by them. It just so happened to be a good venue for it. [00:11:18] Speaker C: Yes. Where was that? [00:11:19] Speaker B: Like the nazi premiere? The premiere of that nazi movie. [00:11:22] Speaker A: Yeah, that's right. [00:11:23] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:11:24] Speaker B: So they go and rescue Appleyard and they. But they have to when they're sailing towards what's the island called? Fernando Poe with the Appleyard's intel that he had, they have to, is to go a longer route and avoid any of the nazi patrols that might be around. So it'll take him 13 days or so. [00:11:47] Speaker A: This part I liked because it's a very real world problem. And I did appreciate Appleyard saying, oh, no, we're fast enough to get there. It's just we, it's not the safest way to go. So we're going to go safe. But then later on they have to go fast and take a chance, which. [00:12:07] Speaker B: I like that one of the hiccups they run into is that actually discovered by a british ship who don't know anything about their mission. And it's an unauthorized mission, so they should get arrested by them. But managed to get out of it. [00:12:26] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:12:27] Speaker B: Back on Fernando Poe, we have some scenes where Margaery is trying to seduce the lead Nazi to get him, him so distracted. So she will. He will come to the party. [00:12:38] Speaker A: You know, she didn't do a lot of seducing in this movie. Did you notice that, Christian? [00:12:41] Speaker B: I was an intellectual seduction. [00:12:46] Speaker C: You laugh. [00:12:46] Speaker B: I'm serious. [00:12:47] Speaker A: I mean, I'm saying it's the least seductive seduction I've ever seen in a movie. [00:12:52] Speaker B: I mean, look, this is a nazi high commander. He could probably, you know, he probably has his fair, you know, share of women that. Who would throw him themselves at him. So he needs probably something. Someone more intellectually stimulating for him to notice. Yeah. So I was okay with that. I'll say. Yeah. It didn't need to necessarily be, you know, TNA. [00:13:18] Speaker A: Yeah, that's fine. I mean, whatever. It's not like I needed that. There was interesting. I don't know if we mentioned this in our live reaction, but I thought it was interesting. The movie was rated r. Yeah, I. [00:13:29] Speaker B: Think that was mostly for the violence, if nothing else. [00:13:32] Speaker A: I mean, entirely for the violence. There's pretty. I don't think there's any even, like, swearing. [00:13:37] Speaker C: I don't. [00:13:38] Speaker A: At least, I don't remember it. [00:13:39] Speaker B: There's some swearing, but, yeah. [00:13:41] Speaker A: So, like I mentioned in the live reaction, in some ways, the movie's like old school movie making, right? [00:13:49] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:13:49] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:13:50] Speaker A: The dirty dozen. Kelly's heroes, back for a time when men were manly. Men who fought and punched, and women were sexy and danced around and sexy dresses. But the movie isn't good to go. [00:14:01] Speaker C: Full regression. [00:14:02] Speaker B: Right. Because Marjorie is still also a very impressive SOE agent. And we get a demonstration of that when Mister Heron has to go recruit some additional forces for the folk, the men on the maid. Maid of honor. [00:14:16] Speaker A: Okay, so which part did this remind you of, Christian? Where our spies operating overseas need to fall in with some shady characters in order to get the resources that they need to complete their mission. [00:14:28] Speaker B: I don't know. What? [00:14:29] Speaker C: Munich. Okay. [00:14:32] Speaker A: These guys were like the french. Like organized crime. [00:14:36] Speaker B: That's the second time you've tried to reference that. And I was like, I don't see it. [00:14:41] Speaker A: Maybe the audience will agree. So you're referring to the part where she shoots. She's really good with the guns. So this is great. It's great. Especially the part where she is the grenade, and they're like, no, no, no, stop. [00:14:52] Speaker B: That was good. I like that. I did like that a lot. Yeah. [00:14:55] Speaker A: Yeah. So it was great. The only problem is it was a setup with no payoff. She never uses those gun skills. [00:15:02] Speaker B: She does. In the very end. [00:15:04] Speaker A: Yeah. You don't need to be a super good marksman to shoot a guy who's standing right in front of you. Spoiler alert. [00:15:09] Speaker C: I don't know. [00:15:10] Speaker A: Just putting it out there. [00:15:11] Speaker B: It's more just to show off that every SOE agent is basically, you know, very well trained, I think. [00:15:17] Speaker C: Yep. [00:15:18] Speaker B: Heron sort of transmits a message back to headquarters as he discovers that Kesa will be relieving port two days earlier than expected. So Gusmarch Phillips and his crew have to figure out how to get there faster, which they basically just do. There's no real, like, oh, we'll just have to go closer to the ships, and then. Okay, that's. It's fine. Nothing happens. [00:15:44] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:15:44] Speaker A: I mean, they alter course, and they say it's a risk, but it worked out. [00:15:48] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. [00:15:50] Speaker B: But, yeah. So it's now the night of the plan, and we find out, you know, at the big party, that Duquesne's hall has been reinforced. So, rather. And so they cannot blow it up. [00:16:04] Speaker A: Yeah, I think this was my favorite part of the movie, was there was the twist where. So first they're like, we have to call off the plan, which is great, because that almost never happens in movies, though. It feels very real, you know? So they have that, and then they have to let the boys, as they call them, they have to let them know without being detected, and then they have to, like, adjust the plan, and they adjust it in a very smart way, which I like. [00:16:30] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah, they do. So, also around this. Well, actually, I've sort of jumped past. At one point, Mister Heron had to cut off the power by planting a bomb. But when he plants the bomb, he gets caught, but then he takes out, like, all of the guys who catch him, with a gun that's in, like, a. In a retractable sleeve. [00:16:53] Speaker A: So I liked him and Marjorie because they're the spies as opposed to the commandos. I like how there's the two teams, and they each have their own jobs, and I was very curious what was gonna happen, because I was like, oh, you know, this guy's a spy. He doesn't fight. This is a grounded and realistic movie, but instead, he just kills them. And he kills them easily. Very easily. [00:17:19] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. Well, like, Marjorie, he's a trained soe agent. [00:17:23] Speaker A: Right? Do you notice that the last German that he kills was, like, old? [00:17:26] Speaker C: No. [00:17:27] Speaker A: Or is that a different part? There's a part where they kill some guy who looks like he's in his, like, fifties, which isn't totally unsurprising, actually. [00:17:35] Speaker C: But, yeah. [00:17:36] Speaker B: So once they find out that it's been reinforced, Heron has to go try to send a message to the maid of honor and also back to headquarters. And also, there's a whole part here where we. Which. Where it's, like, one of the people that Fleming and M. Have been working with has actually been leaking information to someone else in the british admiralty. And that's how that one british ship knew what they were doing and called, like, tried to arrest them, which was. [00:18:08] Speaker A: Actually, I like, that part, too, where they were getting intercepted and very briefly. And then a U boat shows up and the destroyer has to go fight it, and they make their escape. [00:18:18] Speaker C: I mean, it's a bit of a. [00:18:19] Speaker A: Movie cliche, but I still liked it. [00:18:21] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And so, yeah, on the night of the raid on the maid of honor side, you have them, you know, getting that message of that it's been reinforced and figuring out, all right, what do we have to do? So instead of blowing it up, instead they figured out that they're gonna steal the ship. [00:18:40] Speaker A: Very smart. [00:18:41] Speaker B: Pretty good action scenes where Lawson is basically taking out guys left and right on this. Like an unstoppable terminator. [00:18:49] Speaker A: Yes. Well, so this is the part where he's using the axe, right? [00:18:53] Speaker B: Yeah, well, axe and other. [00:18:55] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:18:55] Speaker B: I think everyone has guns that, like silence, guns that take out a lot of the folks very easily. [00:19:02] Speaker A: I'll hold my fire. No pun intended. [00:19:04] Speaker B: Okay. I mean, now is the time. [00:19:07] Speaker A: Okay, so we'll talk about now. I'm glad we waited a few days before we did this dead drop episode because there was something about the movie that rubbed me the wrong way. I think I put my finger on what it is before I read a part I'm gonna read in the spy fact versus fiction, which is so, first of all, my taste for action scenes, especially super violent ones in movies, has decreased for a variety of reasons. But also in this movie, there's no. [00:19:36] Speaker B: Threat that I can see because they like. So that's what. That's what I was getting at with the like. They very easily dispatch a lot of folks with, like, silenced guns extremely easily. [00:19:48] Speaker A: Nobody gets hurt. One person gets hurt the whole movie, and it's, like, not even a big deal. [00:19:55] Speaker B: Well, and I'll get to. I'm very curious what you have for spy fact versus fiction, because I have some stuff as well regarding this whole part. I mean, I enjoyed the action of it. I mostly, you know, mostly with Alan Richardson. But you're right, there was a threat missing. [00:20:11] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:20:12] Speaker A: I mean, especially a movie that's supposed to be based on a true story. They literally just walk down the street and just shoot everybody in sight. I know people. What people have been saying a lot about action movies is that it's like watching a video game. And I don't think I've ever seen a movie that's more applicable than this one. [00:20:30] Speaker B: All right, all right. [00:20:30] Speaker A: One of my sources said that it was like watching a video game played on easy mode. [00:20:36] Speaker B: Okay, okay. [00:20:38] Speaker A: I know we touched on this briefly, but when they rescue Appleyard. [00:20:41] Speaker C: It's like. [00:20:42] Speaker A: It's like they don't even have a plan. There's like, whatever. And then they run in there and they just kill everybody. And then when they rescue him, he looks like he, like, doesn't even care. [00:20:51] Speaker C: He's like. [00:20:52] Speaker A: He's like, how's it going? I understand. Is supposed to be the joke. I understand it's a joke. [00:20:56] Speaker B: The british sense of humor. Come on. [00:20:59] Speaker C: Right. [00:21:00] Speaker B: I'll give you everything besides that. That line and that whole, like, the sentiment back and forth, because that's just british. British dry humor. And it worked for me. [00:21:10] Speaker C: Yeah, sure. [00:21:12] Speaker B: Okay, so, yeah, so they managed to. Well, one, they have to blow the ankle, the anchor, so that it's not still stuck in the port. They also have to blow up the gas supply or the fuel supply so that no ships can chase after them. And then, yeah, use the tugboats to bring away the ducesa, which they do. As all of this is happening, Marjorie is, you know, entertaining the head Nazi by singing a song and slips up by saying, I don't remember what it was, but it's something. A fray, a word or phrase, which was. But she said the yiddish form of it instead of the german form, which I don't know. [00:21:54] Speaker A: Did you buy a christian? Because she's earlier established to be, like, super, super smart, but even super, super smart people mess up. [00:22:01] Speaker B: I bought that as her messing up. I do not think she wanted to get tortured by them. [00:22:06] Speaker A: Obviously she messed up. I think that she did it on purpose, though it would be very much in the movie for her to do it on purpose. I guess my question is, I don't want to call it, like, a plot hole or like, a plot inconsistency that she's been established to be smart and then still make a mistake, but it's better than being perfect, unlike the rest of them, who never mess up. So I would prefer that. [00:22:29] Speaker B: But, yeah, so she gets captured, but then is, for some reason, once everyone hears the explosions and they're. And they're rushing towards the docks, for some reason, Margaery is brought to the docks as well. That didn't make sense to me. [00:22:46] Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. It didn't make a lot of sense. It was a little bit of a convenience. But then I wanted to mention, tying back to what I did before, the part where she's about to get tortured. She looks like someone gave her the wrong order at McDonald's. [00:23:02] Speaker B: Okay, well, I mean, up to a point, she doesn't know she's about to get tortured. It's more. It's like, you know, it's in a red, you know, very not fancy room. And then you see, you know, the chains hanging from the ceiling. [00:23:16] Speaker A: I did think this part was scary. Especially because they get another, like, buddy there. And the guys, all the guys were like so far away. That is like, oh my God, how's she gonna get out of this? Apparently it's cuz the bad guys are dumb. [00:23:29] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:23:30] Speaker B: So she managed to kill the chief Nazi with a tiny derringer that she had hidden in her. In her garter belt. [00:23:39] Speaker A: That's right. [00:23:40] Speaker B: And her and Mister Heron get away and take. And manage to meet up with the captured Dukesa boat again pretty easily. And then we see, you know, them turning themselves over to that same british ship which tried to arrest them earlier. And they're all taken into custody and sent to prison. [00:24:08] Speaker A: Yup. And Churchill leaves them there for a month. I thought that was hilarious. [00:24:14] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. But then, you know, there feels like they're about to be executed because they're lined up against a wall. But instead, who comes in but Churchill, who basically tells them. It starts off like, sounding like he's about to admonish them, but no, he's actually just congratulating them. And it has like this whole feast prepared for them and calls him his ministry of ungentlemanly warfare. And now they report to him. [00:24:41] Speaker A: Yeah, it's like an origin story. It's a superhero origin story, as it turns out. But I did like that. I did like the reveal here where it looks like they're gonna get in trouble. But then he gives them the food. [00:24:51] Speaker C: And comes to see them. [00:24:52] Speaker A: It was very cute. [00:24:54] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:24:54] Speaker B: Yep. We end the movie with the standard, you know, here are the pictures of the real people and what happened to them. [00:25:00] Speaker A: Yes, that's right. [00:25:01] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:25:01] Speaker A: Then we learn that more. I mean, the only thing kind of interested to me was that Marjorie married. [00:25:06] Speaker B: Gus, which, you know, there's like, they had like two interactions maybe. [00:25:12] Speaker A: Well, it must have been after the movie that didn't bug me so much. Certainly the movie had a lot of other things that bugged me, but that. [00:25:19] Speaker B: Wasn'T that, like, so of the people who, you know, joined us at the bar afterwards that like really bugged them. [00:25:27] Speaker C: Oh, really? [00:25:28] Speaker B: No setup to that relationship at all. [00:25:31] Speaker A: Well, here would they have preferred is at the end they see each other and then they make out like in a bunch of other movies. [00:25:36] Speaker C: I don't know. [00:25:36] Speaker B: But anyway, just like a dropped hint of interest in between the two, really, just. But there's like nothing. [00:25:44] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:25:44] Speaker B: But yeah. So that was the one big thing of interest, but yeah. So should we move on to our spy fact first fiction? [00:25:52] Speaker A: Sure, I have a decent amount. So would you like to go first? [00:25:55] Speaker B: Yeah, so I read, well, I'm reading the book and I'm about maybe halfway through, maybe a third of the way through. And actually the. Now I'm very curious because it's the operation postmaster is already done by this point of the book. So there's more stories apparently beyond just this story in this book. So I. I'm curious to find out what's more biggest things is. Well, one, Marjorie Stewart was not a part of this mission. She was an SOE agent. She was an actress before and after the mission. She did marry Gus March Phillips, but she was not a part of this mission. [00:26:38] Speaker C: Yep. [00:26:39] Speaker B: Mister Harran is a sort of combination of a number of different characters according to this book as well. It seems like the plan was always to steal Ducasse, was never to blow it up. [00:26:51] Speaker A: Yeah, that's the biggest change in my mind. [00:26:54] Speaker B: Well, also there's some stuff that. Well, one, the big, other big change is that they didn't kill a single person when they took over the Duquesne. [00:27:04] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:27:04] Speaker A: That would have almost made it more interesting if they hadn't. [00:27:07] Speaker C: Yes. [00:27:07] Speaker B: They basically had to capture the whole thing without killing a single person they like. Yeah. Knocked out a bunch of people and then like later put those people to work when they were sailing it into international waters. [00:27:19] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:27:19] Speaker A: So it was more of a hijacking than a stealing. [00:27:21] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. Also that one of the things I'm a little sad they didn't put on there was. Hold on, let me find it in the book. Um, there was actually a large pig running loose on the deck, one of three pigs that were on board. And it like crashed into one of the SOE agents who was like freaked out by like, what just hit me. I'm a little sad that they didn't actually include that part because that would have been just such a weird thing to have happen. And I can see guy Ritchie doing something fun with that. [00:27:52] Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, the movie has such an off the wall sense of humor anyway that I feel like it would have fit right in. [00:27:59] Speaker B: So that's what I got for spy fact for sure. I just wanted to make sure I mentioned the pig. [00:28:03] Speaker A: Sounds great. Okay, so my sources, history versus Hollywood, a very useful site for these things. So this is based on the loose, they say loosely, obviously. The british army's number 62 commando, also known as the small scale raiding Force, which was founded by major guys. [00:28:21] Speaker B: Technically, that was not actually founded until after this mission, according to the book that I read. So it's like, it is the remnants of those people who are part of that operation. Postmaster became the small scale rating force, or whatever it's called. [00:28:40] Speaker A: Some corrections. The movie places Ian Fleming under the command of General Colin Govins. However, he was actually the personal assistant of Christian. [00:28:50] Speaker B: Oh, what was his name? Is it admiral? [00:28:54] Speaker A: Little impromptu trivia. Rear Admiral John Godfrey. [00:28:57] Speaker B: Godfrey. So, yes and no. He was. But he was also the liaison to soe from the british navy for naval intelligence. So he did work with Gubbins. [00:29:12] Speaker C: Yes. [00:29:12] Speaker A: It also goes on to say Ian's brother Colin, which I didn't know he had a brother, so he reported directly to Gobbins and even took part in two covert missions in Greece and Norway. It said that Anders Lawson did use a bow and arrow. He brought it from his hunting days in Denmark, but he did not rip out the enemy soldier's heart and hold it in his hand. [00:29:34] Speaker C: Aw. [00:29:35] Speaker B: Disappointing. [00:29:36] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:29:36] Speaker A: That was created by the actor to show how he didn't like nazis. I would have believed it. So they did do a party like you said, and then finally the author backs up what I said. He says, it's war. It looks nothing like this. Even the most trained soldiers during World War Two wouldn't have so nonchalantly killed nazis as if they were brushing flies off their shoulders. [00:30:01] Speaker B: To what you said before, I don't think he had a brother named Colin Fleming. [00:30:06] Speaker A: Colin Fleming? [00:30:07] Speaker B: Yeah, there's no Colin Fleming. There was a Peter Fleming and a Richard Fleming and a Michael Fleming, but no Colin Fleming. [00:30:17] Speaker A: Oh, come on. History versus Hollywood. All right. Anyway, they went on to say the four based on real people, main characters, Gus Anders, Jeffrey Appleyard, and Henry Hayes all died. None of them survived the war. [00:30:31] Speaker B: Yep. S March Phillips died. I think it looked like maybe six months after this mission happened, five months after he got married, which was two months after this mission, so seven months ish. Yeah. [00:30:43] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:30:44] Speaker A: On that. On a happy note, that is all my spy fact versus fiction. [00:30:47] Speaker B: All right. I mean, yeah, that was an interesting thing that they did not say that all of them died. [00:30:53] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:30:53] Speaker A: They probably didn't want to end the movie on a down note, which I understand. [00:30:57] Speaker B: Fair enough. [00:30:58] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. [00:30:59] Speaker A: All right, so now it is time for our ratings. On a scale of one to ten martinis, one being Avengers 1998 and ten being mission Impossible ghost protocol, how would we rate the Ministry of ungentlemanly warfare? I usually go first. Yeah. Walking out of the movie, I thought it was like, okay. And then thinking about it later I was like, I don't like it that much. Like it's not bad. [00:31:22] Speaker C: Like it's not bad. [00:31:23] Speaker A: But the characters are not that interesting. I feel like the actors are wasted in their roles. Like you could have just replaced them with a stunt guy and the movie would have been more or less the same. I like the two spies on the island, but the action scenes are pretty boring. I've seen Nazis get killed a million times in movies and I've killed Nazis a million more times with my own two hands playing video games. So yeah, watching Nazis get gunned down is getting old, is getting kind of boring. So there were a couple things I liked. I liked the twist where they have to steal the boats rather than blow them up. That was neat. But the characters are just so invincible. There's so little tension. So I'm gonna give, I'm just gonna say the movie's okay. I'm gonna give it a five out of ten. [00:32:12] Speaker C: All right. [00:32:12] Speaker B: All right. I mean sitting, coming out of the movie theater, I really liked it. Sitting with it for a couple of days. And also as I'm learning more and more about what actually happened, you know. Yeah, it brought it down a little bit, but not that much. I, unlike you, I enjoyed Henry Cavill and Alan Richardson supremely inter, like I put it, don't put a stuntman in there. That's part of acting is the physicality and they rule with that physicality there. I enjoyed just the roguishness of it. Henry Cavill and but I do wonder if this sort of even just this further role in the spy world really just rules him out for Bond because he's just done too many things that are too close to Bond, whether it be man from Uncle Argyle and this, I wish I'd gotten more, more character from Henry Golding who's, you know, he's in there but he's not. Doesn't have much to do really. Alan RiCHArdson I think probably stole the show off anything. Uh, and just how much, you know, how much his character hated Nazis and his sheer brutality which, you know, you can see a lot of that on display in Reacher as well as he's a, you know, reacher in the Amazon series Jack or he is Jack Reacher in the Amazon series Reacher. So I mean I still enjoyed the action but yes, alright. There is a sense of invincibility to it. That being said, I'm still going to give this a seven out of ten martinius. [00:33:41] Speaker A: Nice yeah, I feel like the potential, the characters, they had something we just needed. Less random gunning down people, more character stuff. [00:33:50] Speaker C: That would have been good. [00:33:52] Speaker B: Do you have anything else to say? [00:33:54] Speaker A: No, I don't think so. Thank you to everyone who came out to join us at the Alamo Drafthouse for our first ever live, I don't want to say live show, live something. [00:34:04] Speaker B: Yeah, actually, I do have to say something. So the day after we had our live appearance, I actually got to meet up with a number of James Bond fans from around the DC area in the first ever meeting of what we're calling Capitol Royale, the DC James DC metro area James Bond fan club. So if you are in the DC area, you know, find us on social media. There's pages for all of those. We're figuring out how we're going to sort of facilitate this group, but I think it'll be a lot of fun. [00:34:38] Speaker A: Sounds great. I wish the group all the best. So thank you all for joining us. You can find us on social media at thespy guys, on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram, and our merch [email protected], until next time, I'm Zach. [00:34:53] Speaker B: I'm Christian. [00:34:54] Speaker A: And we are the spy fi guys signing off. [00:35:00] Speaker E: Thank you for listening to the spy fi guys. If you enjoyed our podcast, please be sure to give us a five star rating on iTunes. The theme song from this podcast is mistake the Getaway by Kevin McClellan from incompetech.com, licensed under Creative Commons by Attribution 3.0. Films, books, and television shows reviewed by our podcast are the intellectual property of their respective copyright holders, and no infringement is intended. [00:35:27] Speaker F: This is a personal podcast. Any views, statements, or opinions expressed in this podcast are personal and belong solely to the participants. They do not represent those of people, institutions, or organizations that the participants may or may not be associated with in a professional or personal capacity unless explicitly stated. Any views or opinions are not intended to malign any religion, ethnic group, club, organization, company, or individual. [00:35:52] Speaker E: You can find our podcast on social media at thespyguys, on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram.